QUESTION: Recording mixdown / tweaking fader levels as you go and saving tweaks in recorded mix?

[My Salamander]

Hi all! New to this forum. I've used a Roland VS-2480 for quite a few years which allows you to tweak and save fader level changes in your mix as you go through the song in recording your mixdown (i.e. you can spot tweak fader levels here and there via "snapshot" which are saved for purposes of recording the mix, such that you can get a perfectly tweaked set of fader levels saved for your mix in a single effort without having to literally move the faders as you are recording the mix and then having to start all over in recording the mix if you forget to move one fader up or down at some point in the song (for example, if you need to bump a harmony vocal slightly up or down as you go through the mixdown). Does the TASCAM DP-24 or 32 have this feature (or anything similar) or no? I've read in several reviews that neither the DP-24 or 32 have any "automated mixing" - so wondering whether that means when you're recording a mixdown you have to manually get all the fader level bumps correct as its recording the mix in order to avoid having to start all over in recording the mixdown if you forget to bump a fader level at a certain point. Surprisingly have not seen this discussed anywhere, so would greatly appreciate any insight - thanks!

 

[-mjk-]

The Digital Portastudios have no automation. All mixes done on a DP machine are manual.

 

[My Salamander]

Thanks for your reply! So to confirm, when recording a mixdown you have to manually move/bump the fader levels as you record the mix - and if you forget to bump a fader level up or down (for example on a harmony vocal in one part of the song), you would then simply have to start over and record the entire mix again making sure you move the fader levels where needed as the song plays?

 

[-mjk-]

Thanks for your reply! So to confirm, when recording a mixdown you have to manually move/bump the fader levels as you record the mix - and if you forget to bump a fader level up or down (for example on a harmony vocal in one part of the song), you would then simply have to start over and record the entire mix again making sure you move the fader levels where needed as the song plays?

Yes.

You have mentioned 2 models of interest: DP-24 and DP-32. Note that these models without the "SD" suffix do have MIDI capability. I have played around with the MIDI functions to use the knobs and faders on my DP-32 as a DAW controller. I never did anything with it; more of a matter of can it be done? Yes, it can. In the DP MIDI implementation documentation it would appear that one could automate a mix to some degree with MIDI input since the documentation mentions all the parameters that can be controlled with MIDI.

Theoretically, one could sync the MMC of the DP with a DAW and record a MIDI track in the DAW. Then, again, in theory, one could start the DP machine and have the DAW play back the MIDI data and have it manipulate the controls that were recorded. Note that there are no motorized parts on the DP machines, so the faders wouldn't move.

If you have a DP machine with MIDI and nothing better to do, you could spend an afternoon monkeying around with it and see what happens.

 

[dctdct]

Thanks for your reply! So to confirm, when recording a mixdown you have to manually move/bump the fader levels as you record the mix - and if you forget to bump a fader level up or down (for example on a harmony vocal in one part of the song), you would then simply have to start over and record the entire mix again making sure you move the fader levels where needed as the song plays?

As @-mjk- correctly stated, it is possible with the MIDI capable units.
A starting point might be this example.

So you don't have to experiment from the beginning.

 

[-mjk-]

Yeah, I saw that years ago. Same principles, however this requires one to have a MIDI sequencer. In my own studio, I do have a MIDI workstation keyboard/sequencer, however I also am using Reaper which can record tracks that contain anything, audio, video, MIDI (even within the same track). So I simply used Reaper to record the MIDI output from my DP-32 and that worked. All MIDI gear in my studio is interconnected with a MIDI hub for convenience.

 

[Old No7]

I'm no where near being a master of the DPs like others on here, but as I haven't contributed in awhile I'll offer this crazy thought...

Could the OP accomplish the desired end result of having the final mix include those sections where a fader was adjusted by cloning or copying the "source track" to an unused "target track", and then dubbing or copying in "only the desired section" of the target back into the source track but at a lower/higher volume than the original it's replacing?

A friend once told me "It's always easier to think outside the box if you're not in it!"... And in the spirit of that comment, I'll offer this thought as it seems logical to me it could work.

IF it will work, that is...

Old No7

 

[shredd]

I'm no where near being a master of the DPs like others on here

Don't knock it...your friend was right!
"Inexperienced' is a lot easier to overcome than "stewpyd". Trust me.
I'm pretty experienced with the P/Studio's (nearly 20 yrs on the 2488 series, and now several years on an O/G DP-32)...and I've never accomplished a MIDI-based auto-adjusting solution...until a few years ago, "MIDI" was an ethereal, incomprehensible world similar to curing cancer, or perhaps trying to identify integrity in politics (both next to impossible).

BUT: I have done exactly what you described: taking a section of a track (for example, a git'r solo or the chorus section of a vocal) and separated it for modif'n...for example, I might copy/past that section to another track, then modify or add FX/treatment as desired, then either put it back in the original, or even mix them up and bounce them to a third track.
I've even done this with vox instead of 'double tracking' them...because my hearing is so bad that I have a better chance of Taylor Swift showing up at my door with a bottle of champagne asking to share my hot tub than of recording two takes of a vocal that are even close enough to each other to blend...

That said...I do occasionally do some fader-jockeying during mix. It's just easier, as long as it's just a couple things or a couple of places.

 

[-mjk-]

Years ago I outlined a method of mixing mixes. This may be useful:

https://www.tascamforums.com/posts/29234

 

[Old No7]

Great feedback -- thanks for sharing!

(Guess it wasn't such a crazy idea after all...)

Old No7

 

[-mjk-]

(Guess it wasn't such a crazy idea after all...)

A tried and true workflow. I saw a video last week from a producer who did a mix for a client. The client also did their own mix and asked if the mixes could be combined in order to create a final mix that contained all the elements of both mixed. The producer stated that ordinarily, he wouldn't consider something like that but with nothing to lose he did it, and the client loved the combined mix.

Except for obvious technical issues (like thousands of clipped peaks) I say that whatever it takes to get the outcome you want is acceptable (as long as it is legal and morally acceptable).