Model12 ...midi sync question?

Discussion in 'Model 24/16/12' started by Musicman666, Jul 28, 2020.

  1. Musicman666

    Musicman666 New Member

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    Is the model 12 able to midi sync lock with midi hardware such as as sequencers and drum machines so that I can jog backwards and forwards along the track without any drift...??
  2. -mjk-

    -mjk- Moderator Staff Member

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    The website says:

    "Standard MIDI in/out connectors allow connection with a wide range of keyboards, drum machines, controllers, and other sources that employ MIDI connectors. The Model 12 can also be used for synchronized operation of multi-track recorders and other external devices like drum machines."

    https://tascam.com/us/product/model_12/feature
  3. Musicman666

    Musicman666 New Member

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    Yes this is what got me excited but here’s the thing, I bought the Tascam dp32 midi a few years ago and that was also supposed to midi lock as well but didn’t and tascam didn't bother to try and fix it with an upgrade ...so now I need confirmation before I pull the trigger on this model12...I spoke to my local music shop and they didn’t know either but they told me to try this forum as they would be able to confirm it...so here I am...

    ...perhaps there is an email address I could try?
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2020
  4. -mjk-

    -mjk- Moderator Staff Member

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    The key words are "synchronized operation". If it doesn't work as advertised, send it back.

    FWIW I own a DP-32. It synchronizes perfectly with my drum machine and keyboard. The drum machine even chases when jogging.

    When you say:

    Are you expecting to jog to a position and have instantaneous sync?

    The Tascam Forums are not affiliated with Tascam and are privately operated. You should contact Tascam support directly.
  5. Musicman666

    Musicman666 New Member

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    ...well yes instantaneous is a good description...say i am working on a song and i need to go into the middle of the track and work on one particular area ..say drop in a guitar part or edit the midi in the sequencer ...it would be good to have all the parts playing along in unison simultaneously so i can get a constant picture of what i'm doing...so if you are able to do that i would be most impressed.

    ...regarding the dp32 midi unit you have a very unique experience ...many on the facebook group of that machine have failed to get it working reliably..in fact its quite a common problem elsewhere on the net ...personally the most i could ever achieve was to have both starting together but only if i ran it from the beginning and the tascam was master... it wasn't ideal...if i remember correctly tascam did only one fix to address one flaw in the midi and then it was suddenly discontinued with a replacement model without midi!!... its quite a long time ago now but i doubt its been fixed.

    ..perhaps what you are getting is a start and stop on the drum machine but thats just a basic midi clock type operation ...what i need is the mmc level commands so it can really lock solid like a timecode....the dp32 actually said "mmc" in the menu...it just didn't do it.
    Last edited: Jul 29, 2020
  6. -mjk-

    -mjk- Moderator Staff Member

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    The users on the Tascam Forums have a significantly different experience with the DP-32 MIDI than the FB group apparently, because many of use routinely and successfully use the machine to control MIDI operations.

    @Musicman666 You've made incorrect assumptions about what other people are doing with their machines. You didn't really read what I wrote above:

    I have synced my DP-32 with Reaper, and that works too. Every single piece of gear in my studio is MIDI except my guitar amps. I have a MIDI hub and MIDI patching software. I can do anything I want with MIDI. The only problems I have ever encountered were operator issues where I failed to set things up properly.

    I have even successfully used my DP-32 as a DAW controller for Sonar, via MIDI (I don't use it like that, I just wanted to see if it could be done). Since purchasing a used unit in 2018, I've used it to control my drum machine for recording drum tracks, and recording a single drum part at at time and they all line up perfectly. I also use it for arpeggio control on my KORG keyboard. My experience is not unique by any means.

    But there is no such thing as instantaneous synchronization of anything. If you jog somewhere and press Play, it takes a few frames to get going. That's just how it is, even if you use SMPTE. And no synchronization system is perfect. It is what it is, and you have to engineer your recordings accordingly.
  7. Phil Tipping

    Phil Tipping Moderator Staff Member

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    Just to clarify, MMC is MIDI Machine Control and offers transport control to allow stop/start/positioning. It does not keep things in sync to prevent drifting throughout a song. For that you need regular clock messages. These are either simple timing clocks, which are sent at precisely regular intervals so the receiver can keep count of passing time, or time code (MTC), which are regular messages containing the absolute time (as in SMPTE). I only have the newer DP machine without MIDI so can't advise on yours (I use an external sync box with my dp-32sd).
    Update: the clock settings are under the SYNC item on the MIDI screen; MMC is a separate item.
    Last edited: Jul 30, 2020
    Mark Richards, -mjk- and Musicman666 like this.
  8. Musicman666

    Musicman666 New Member

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  9. -mjk-

    -mjk- Moderator Staff Member

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    Oh, well if the clock isn't set then, yes, all you're getting is transport control functions, not sync.

    As I recall, if you stop the DP machine in the middle of a song, and press Play to resume, the slaved machines will be out of sync. One must move the jog wheel a few frames to re-sync things. Then the slave machines should start where the DP machine is currently set.
  10. Musicman666

    Musicman666 New Member

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    i will buy the model 12 and report back if sync is successful...
    -mjk- likes this.
  11. -mjk-

    -mjk- Moderator Staff Member

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    @Musicman666 yes, please do give us a report back! That kind of direct user feedback is gold. Your participation is helping others. Thank you.