DM 3200/4800 - Windows 10 Compatibility - My Final Results

[cmaffia]

Updated on 10/26/19 to reflect most current status:

Windows 10 with the DM series gets my thumbs up.
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I have finished testing the DM3200 and its core functionality using Windows 10, build 1903. I'm using the same PC that I use with Windows 7 (Using Boot Manager - 2 OS's on 2 separate physical drives). The information below can be applied to the DM4800 as well. Hopefully this post can be a starting point for Windows users however depending on hardware variables, your results may differ.

Here are my test results based on core functionality:

Test 1:
USB connectivity/Remote Layer functionality
Results - PASS - I was able to map the Remote Layer across 2 Cascaded Dm3200's as well.

Test 2:
TMC application
Results - PASS - All functionality works as it should.

Test 3:
IF-FW/MKII FireWire/ASIO Driver (V1.30f9.)
Results - PASS - For average projects recorded at 88.1 kHz, I had my buffer set to 256 using the Low Latency setting without any audio drop outs being reported. DPC checker reported 40-90uS with the PC at rest and 300-400uS during project playback.
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Here are my recommended steps after completing your initial Windows 10 installation:

Complete the following steps (in order!):

1. Perform all Windows 10 System Updates. Make sure you are using the latest build.
2. Install and use the Legacy OHCI IEEE 1394 driver. Just like Windows 7 & 8, the Windows 10 default driver will cause severe performance issues with your FireWire card and the IF-FW/MKII. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=44218
3. Install IF-FW/MKII FireWire/ASIO Driver (V1.30f9.)
   Get it here (FTP Site): UPDATE - FTP SITE NO LONGER WORKING.
   https://dev.tascam-parc.com/parc_beta/
   Username : iffwdm
   Password : firefly
4. Install Tascam TMC. http://tascam.com/content/downloads/products/34/tmc_install_90372_1.51_release.zip
5. Install your DAW software, plugins & supporting applications.
6. Once everything is working, I strongly suggest creating a system image of your C: drive using Windows 10's "Create System Image" utility. https://answers.microsoft.com/en-us...ndows-10/84fa6683-e3ac-4e93-9139-368af9267869

WDM Playback:
Make sure your WDM audio playback settings match your board's sample rate. By default its set to 44.1 kHz and doesn't change automatically. You need to manually change or else you will have playback issues. The following instructions work in Windows 10 as well. You need to choose the IF-FW/MKII audio card of course. https://forums.adobe.com/thread/973133

Disable Network Interface Card/WIFI:
I also recommend disabling WIFI and the Network Interface Card while using DAW. This practice has nothing to do with Windows 10 as it is a known fact that having these services enabled (in any version of Windows) can cause the IF-FW/MKII to unlock and/or produce audio dropouts.

Cascading:
Note that if you're Cascading 2 DM's, you'll need to rename one of the Tascam USB devices (I renamed one DM3200-II). Windows names them the same so you'll need to differentiate them or else your DAW will not be able to map the 4 Mackie Controls (6 for DM4800) successfully. Follow this procedure for taking ownership of the registry entry when renaming: http://www.avoiderrors.net/rename-devices-device-manager/
Here's my documented journey with figuring out that you have to change one of the DM's USB device names. This needs to be done in both Windows and MAC OS's!!
http://www.tascamforums.com/threads/dm-4800-cascade-mode.264/page-3

I'm happy to report the following devices work perfectly in Windows 10:

• Punchlight USB
• Frontier Tranzport - Need to install drivers in Windows 7 compatibility mode. Multiple Tranzports work as as well despite Frontier Design Group's claim that it wont (did they even try??).
• UAD PCIe DSP Processors
• Steinberg CC121

Issues:

• An unrelated topic worth mentioning is the inconclusive report that FireWire 400 cards are not reliable in some of the newer motherboards and is causing issues with the IF/FW MKII. However, success has been reported here: http://www.tascamforums.com/threads/motherboard-chipsets-and-firewire-400.4254/

Additional Optimization:
Lastly, I've included some documentation below that can help you optimize Windows 10 for DAW purposes.

 

[jamsire]

I say bypass the Remote Layer and midi learn across both boards with a physical midi cable coming from the computer into the physical MIDI IN port in the board. That way your faders on screen will move the faers on the console as well.

 

[cmaffia]

I know Jamsire and using only 1 dm if I ever want to use the remote layer isn't the real showstopper. It's a non issue for the single console user. It's the performance of the FireWire drivers that affects us all. I'm back to the days before I knew you had to use the legacy FireWire drivers in Windows 7. In Win7 my DPC count peaks at 60 at rest. In Win10, 400. In Windows 10 there are 2 FireWire drivers available. The standard and the Texas instrument compatible driver (which I thought was equivalent to the Windows 7 legacy drivers). Both perform the same way. I am using 1 PC with 2 separate OS drives with a boot manager so it's the same exactly hardware.

 

[Arjan P]

Mmh, that doesn't sound good indeed.. Not sure about the cascading thing, but I believe MS are still working on some audio improvements for Windows 10.

If indeed there will be no improvement, after giving it a try with Win10 this summer, I'll revert back to Win7 and stick it out for the coming years. Current and probably some future Cubase versions will run on it, and if not, there's nothing wrong with staying on a working older version. Software will be no reason for me to turn my whole studio around - after all, I worked with the Akai DPS-16 for years and years also.

 

[cmaffia]

My brother from another mother! I too was using a DPS16 and 24 before moving to the DM3200. I'm not bailing on the DM3200 but after my win10 experience, it feels like for the first time that there's an expiration date on my current setup. If it wasn't for the fact that the DM3200 is EOL, I wouldn't be so pessimistic.

 

[cmaffia]

GOOD NEWS
If you install the package linked below, this installs the legacy driver in Windows 10 and now all is perfect. There's still the USB naming/cascade issue though but for 99% of you I can say that we are safe with the firewire performance in Windows 10.

Note that when you execute the package it will not show as a 3rd driver option. In the device manager you need to right click on the existing driver, choose update, then choose let me choose my own location and point to C:\program files (x86)\1394 OHCI Compliant Host Controller (Legacy)". It will then install the driver and you'll see it listed.

https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=44218

 

[Arjan P]

Hey that's great! Downloaded for future upgrade; I guess my system is now ready for Windows 10. Hopefully your USB naming issue for cascading can be helped somehow.

 

[cmaffia]

If the USB naming issue can't be fixed then it's just a small price to pay in order to survive the next 10 years. Hopefully RedBus is reading this ;-). Even better news is that the DPC count is just a tad lower than Windows 7 using the last beta driver for windows.

 

[cmaffia]

Other than the inability to map the remote layer across 2 DM3200's/DM4800's (which I realize is a small minority of us), it looks like the DM Series has survived the Windows 10 release. Windows 10 seems more stable and my same hardware is performing better. I'm hoping someone at Tascam has the time to resolve the Remote Layer issue.

I can also confirm that the Frontier Tranzport still works in Windows 10. I'm mentioning it in this forum only because I know a lot of you use and depend upon it. The trick to get the Tranzport drivers to install is you must install it using Windows 7 compatibility mode. If you don't it will install halfway with a pop-up a message saying it can't be installed on this version of Windows.

 

[Arjan P]

Good news, thanks for reporting! I was just about to ask you about the Tranzport, but that's also good to hear. Now for me the only questions remaining are my Midisport 8x8 interface and an E-mu PCI sound card that I use (with analog out) for my Windows sounds.

Ah, and ofcourse the 2Seemy USB, Punchlight USB, Akai LPK25 and Focusrite VRM Box. But I would expect those items to transfer OK.

 

[cmaffia]

All issues resolved. Windows 10 did a mandatory update Note you can no longer disable updates. MS now forces you to do updates with limited control for it to interfere with your daily usage. After it did what appears to have been a huge update, the USB ports now show up and I now can use the remote layer across both DM3200's.

I am testing the Punchlight USB now. Will report when completed.

 

[cmaffia]

Punchlight USB works in Win10

 

[Arjan P]

Nice! About the updates in Win10; the Professional version allows postponing updates, but full control is no longer possible. A very handy tool BTW for those not too sure about privacy in Win10 is this: https://www.oo-software.com/en/shutup10

 

[jamsire]

And what I didn't remember to add was this:

The day I >>have to upgrade my computer<< and my FW card is no longer supported is the day I buy additional audio interface hardware to go from the computer to console. Thunderbolt will most likely be on some ridiculous speed clock by then, and there will be some awesome interfaces that will eventually suit my needs - and I've looked at quite a few. Since I have three analog cards, I can use those and any open TDIF slots to connect additional audio to mix through the console.

I've got - "plans."

All my audio still goes through Cubase 6.07, Pro Tools 11, and Ableton Live 8 and it still sounds great. I only do about 5-10% editing anyway - and I have a fair amount of outboard gear. 24 tracks is usually all I need and 32 tracks is more than enough - for me and me only.

Continued success in Cubase 8.xx and above.

Windows 10 scares me like standing on a rope bridge in the mountains during a windy rainstorm.

 

[cmaffia]

Jamsire your plan is one of several alternatives that everyone can consider. Thanks for mapping it out.

In regards to Windows 10: It's understandable to fear the unknown. I could freeze my system like you suggest but I want the option to move forward as well. In fact I've accomplished both by implementing a dual boot Windows 7/ Windows 10 system. I now have the best of both worlds. I can enjoy the stability I have relied upon for the last 3 years and also gain the trust of Windows 10 without the threat of disrupted continuity.

I can vouch that Windows 10 appears to be very stable, quicker on the same hardware and is more like Windows 7 than 8 was. I can also vouch that core DM functionality works the same, if not better, in Windows 10. What I consider "core" functionality is as follows:

• IF-FW/DMmkII V1.30f10 drivers (using the legacy OHCI Compliant IEEE 1394 Host driver) https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/download/details.aspx?id=44218
• MIDI functionality from the DAW using the FW MIDI IN port
• DM3200 USB device
• TMC application

I can also confirm that a few other popular devices work such as Steinberg's CC121, the Frontier Tranzport (install drivers using Win7 compatibility mode) and the Punchlight USB.

In the end, it all comes down to what's best for you. Currently there are scenarios where you will be forced to use an operating system no older than Windows 8 (such as purchasing a new DAW workstation). My intention here is to report that all is well with our DM's if you have the need or desire to upgrade to Windows 10.

All the best,
Charlie

 

[jamsire]

I understand.

As long as my music doesn't sound like it was done on Windows XX.x and recorded with XX.x software - I will always be current.

 

[AudioWave]

Note that both Intel & AMD have announced that new microprocessors from Intel & AMD due out latter this year will only work on W10 forward.

 

[cmaffia]

...and there's yet another example of how one would be forced to Win10 if their existing hardware failed. You would have to build a new "old stock" PC otherwise.

 

[AudioWave]

And that will likely be an issue for Enterprise corporate business users that have software that only over the past few years have moved from XP to W7 that won't be able or willing to jump on W10 so quickly. They will need also need to rely on custom Frankenstein's.

 

[cmaffia]

Found a new issue. I can't for the life of me get the console to play in 44.1 or 44.8 only 88.2 and 96khz. I am out of ideas. Rebooted everything but no dice. When I boot in Windows 7 it works fine in all 4 Fs modes.