Let's talk VI's and Routing

[jamsire]

I'll begin. Even though I seem to have more plugins than any one geetar man should ever have, I use my Korg Kronos directly into the console via six outputs from the keyboard. BFD2 or and analog drum machine for drums.

What y'all got and how do you route? Why is your setup the way it is?

Proceed.

 

[hammarj]

I have wondered about the need to pipe all outputs into the DM. I have an OASYS and have thought about it although one of the main reasons for getting the 3200 was to allow me to connect all my other keys plus theremin and other controllers and minimize patching. I sometimes have considered running some like the Ms2000 in left channel (mono feed) only to conserve inputs. Are you actually parsing the outputs on the Kronos in the mix? I guess since I am more partial to using pgms vs combos I didn't think there would be an upside to more than stereo. And as I'm sure many home warriors can attest, when I spend more time fricking around with the gear than playing music I have defeated the purpose.
Rgrds John
R

 

[jamsire]

I have wondered about the need to pipe all outputs into the DM. I have an OASYS and have thought about it although one of the main reasons for getting the 3200 was to allow me to connect all my other keys plus theremin and other controllers and minimize patching. I sometimes have considered running some like the Ms2000 in left channel (mono feed) only to conserve inputs. Are you actually parsing the outputs on the Kronos in the mix? I guess since I am more partial to using pgms vs combos I didn't think there would be an upside to more than stereo. And as I'm sure many home warriors can attest, when I spend more time fricking around with the gear than playing music I have defeated the purpose.
Rgrds John
R

I'm getting ready to make a video showing my midi guitar setup. Combi's are the way to go my friend. If you get a couple of analog card - you will be set with the routing. Better than a patchbay.

 

[hammarj]

It's not that I am unfamiliar with combis as I own 5 korgs, it has more to do with the fact that if I use a combi, I don't have a post-performance need to separate out the components, and up until now haven't done that much recording anyway. It used to be all about the gear with me, and I finally decided to make it about playing the music. What attracted me to the DM was 'turn-it-on and you play' as opposed to launching the DAW before that happened, and the FW interface to which I use with Logic X into the latest Macmini. I had buyer's remorse for a while trying to figure out routing, but one day it started clicking after talking to a Tascam rep at AES this year. As to the analog card, my goal is to not rely on DAW to play anything, but rely on the DM. I use every port on the box. The patchbay is more for various Foogers, and a few delays.

 

[jamsire]

It's not that I am unfamiliar with combis as I own 5 korgs, it has more to do with the fact that if I use a combi, I don't have a post-performance need to separate out the components, and up until now haven't done that much recording anyway. It used to be all about the gear with me, and I finally decided to make it about playing the music. What attracted me to the DM was 'turn-it-on and you play' as opposed to launching the DAW before that happened, and the FW interface to which I use with Logic X into the latest Macmini. I had buyer's remorse for a while trying to figure out routing, but one day it started clicking after talking to a Tascam rep at AES this year. As to the analog card, my goal is to not rely on DAW to play anything, but rely on the DM. I use every port on the box. The patchbay is more for various Foogers, and a few delays.

I knew you knew when you said OASYS. If you are in NYC, lemme know. We can do this easier.

 

[hammarj]

North NJ - close but always a journey for the impatient driver...

 

[captdan]

"Why is your setup the way it is?"

About 90% of time, I'm involved producing my own original instrumentals - contemporary jazz pieces. I've done three albums, and have had a modicum of success in the genre. Although jazz guitar is my main 'voice,' I'm a decent keyboardist and programmer as well. So, I've got those bases well covered, and for those I don't, I hire out reed players, etc, who lay their tracks remotely.
For bass, I go back and forth between using Xpand! patches and playing J-bass live. It just depends.

The remaining 5% of studio time involves mastering others' work, which is mainly an ITB approach.

My main goal - or bag, as it were - is looking for different ways to blend sounds. I consider what I do as much about audio design as it is about arranging, playing, and writing, To me, finding THAT hook, rhythmic figure, or blend of elements is similar to a wine or coffee fiend seeking the right 'brew.' Melody is important; but the 'skeleton' - even more so.

So - I've set up my studio to serve that purpose. My V/I rack consists of about 8 applications. They, along with my various guitars, and often used Kurzweil KVX2 (yes, THAT oldie/moldie), and a smattering of live percussion pieces are my 'kit.' Everything is pretty much hardwired to the DM3200; I rarely have to repatch anything. And all the V/I's are ready at hand, to be plugged into ProTools templates which I essentially 'recycle' from project to project.

As mentioned in a previous post, most of my apps - Stylus/RMX, Kontakt, etc, or set up for individual outputs. I mix OTB, so I like to have the main parts routed to individual faders, particularly the important stuff - main keys, snares, kiks, hats, and lead voices. I may, for example, have a 'room drum kit' designated for a stereo pair, and sub mix that element in the host application. But I'll generally blend that stereo element with individually routed parts for better mix control.

At other times - depending on how time pressed or lazy I feel - I might load two instances of Kontakt or Stylus because I want to experiment with two different approaches and am not ready to do any fancy internal routing from one instance.
But, I'm doing that less and less these days. I'd rather keep things slim and trim.

There it is; more info than you asked for; and far less than I could bore you more with.

CaptDan

 

[Gravity Jim]

My DM3200 and FireWire card are connected to an aging 8-core Mac Pro jammed with RAM, SSDs, two DVD burners, a smokin' video card driving two 24" widescreen displays and an AUD-2 card. Plugged into the back of the console are four mic inputs from the live room, line inputs from a Kurweil K2000R, a Roland JV 1080, a Novation SuperNova II, a Roland JD keyboard synth, a Yamaha CP33 stage piano (master controller), a Bass POD, H&K Redbox Pro and a Radial JDI, sends and returns for two Lexicon MPX-1s, aux send to a JK Audio DAP2 Bluetooth phone patch, talk back mic in, etc....

My VI selection really covers the waterfront: Komplete 8 (mostly Kontakt with a big selection of instruments, but I use all it at one time or another), Omnisphere, Plogue Chipsounds (game devs love it), Arturia Analog Lab. I don't preload anything into templates because I like to start with a blank slate.

My set up is this way because I provide a wide range of commercial audio services to ad agencies, video producers and game devs. I compose and produce music, do voice-over, design SFX, write jingles, mix and master for other musicians, etc. 80 of my work is original music and VO, and when I compose I like to have all my tools at arms reach... Guitars, old synths, VIs, plugs and hardware processors, blah blah blah. I hate repatching and have my studio set up so no mic, guitar or bass is more than one cable away from use (I just recently drove the last nail into that structure by moving my amp head and pedal array into the control room, with a choice of three cabs in the live room, so I finally have access to both the amp and the console at the same time.)

My clients tend to surprise me, and if I have save the mix I'm working on and recall an old mix so they can hear it out in Scottsdale, I only have to push a few buttons, make a phone call, hit play, and then go right back to what I was doing.

My neurotic insistence on instant access to hardware and a hyper-orderly work environment is a big reason why I bought a DM console. I thought long and hard about going ITB when I got tired of the sound of my 16-bit Yamaha 02R, but trying to figure out how to wire in all this junk (and make the software work) made my head hurt. Besides, clients are still impressed by moving faders, especially these nice silver ones.

 

[captdan]

Great stuff, Jim. I like the way you think.

CaptDan

 

[jamsire]

I have literally OVERMAXED the possible physical inputs on my DM4800!!

1. All 24 M/L - spoken for. (24)
2. All 3 analog cards - spoken for. (24)
3. ADAT in - spoken for (8)
4. Both Digital In's - spoken for (4)
5. 1 TDIF - spoken for. (8)
6. All Aux's - spoken for. (8)

That's 76 physical inputs at the ready via routing. If I used the the tow TDIF's - that would be a total of 92 physical at the ready.

Seriously - I'm really fun otherwise.

 

[captdan]

I have literally OVERMAXED the possible physical inputs on my DM4800!!

1. All 24 M/L - spoken for. (24)
2. All 3 analog cards - spoken for. (24)
3. ADAT in - spoken for (8)
4. Both Digital In's - spoken for (4)
5. 1 TDIF - spoken for. (8)
6. All Aux's - spoken for. (8)

That's 76 physical inputs at the ready via routing. If I used the the tow TDIF's - that would be a total of 92 physical at the ready.

Seriously - I'm really fun otherwise.

And also a very good example of why a 4800 is preferable to a 3200 in certain cases. {Insert picture of Ernie tearing his hair out in front of a DM3200, trying to figure how he'll accommodate 8 'orphaned' analog inputs strewn all about his floor.}

CaptDan

 

[jamsire]

And also a very good example of why a 4800 is preferable to a 3200 in certain cases. {Insert picture of Ernie tearing his hair out in front of a DM3200, trying to figure how he'll accommodate 8 'orphaned' analog inputs strewn all about his floor.}

CaptDan

AAAHHHHRRRRGGGGGHHHHH!!!!!

There ya go. All my locs - gone.

 

[hammarj]

Ah, I see what you meant by analog card. I am in IT and think of cards as PC Two things come to mind. I am getting an AES/EBU card and now wish I got the 4800, but as it is I have about 4 sq ft of human space left.
How are you using the TDIF?

 

[hammarj]

Sorry for the disconnect. My comments were for jamsire....

 

[jamsire]

How are you using the TDIF?

They are another 8 channel input from an ADAT-TDIF converter.

 

[hammarj]

They are another 8 channel input from an ADAT-TDIF converter.

That is something I had not considered. Always thought of TDIFF as for Tascam or compatible devices, such as DAT recorder. I see the RME box, a little pricey but it would appear with that I could use the inboard TDIFFs. What converter are you using? Thanks for info.