SCSI Multi Drive Enclosure

I use scsi enclosures and it is a good way of using multiple drives and swapping drives with different projects.

Looking at the one in the link, the connectors to the enclosure seem to be 68 pin. However the pins inside the enclosure for the drives to slot into seem to be 80 pin. You can actually use 80pin drives on the MX this way (with 68 to 80 pin conversion) but if you have all 68 pin drives already they won't work in this enclosure (if I am correct).

So you may want to look around for a full 68 pin enclosure. My bays have fully enclosed drive caddies with 68 pin connectors inside.

You will also need to have an active terminator plugged into the second plug on the rear of the unit to make it all work.

Alan.
 
Thanks, I didn't realize that I could use the 80 pin drives. I have not been able to locate any of this type of enclosures on ebay that have the internal 68 pin connectors. There are some sites that have new enclosures that are 68/68 pin but they're a little more than I want to spend right now.

-andrew
 
The 80 pin drives have the power and the ID pins included in the 1 connection. There is actually several 80 to 68 pin adaptors on the market that will work to but the case you are looking at will do the conversion (I think). Remember that you still need to watch what size drives you use, I would not recommend anything over 72 gig and then only with the latest operating system.

The scsi cases I have actually have bays that rack out and they are 68pin so I can't use the 80 pin. There are a lot of 68 pin enclosures on the market that hold several drives permanently screwed in like a computer tower that are very cheap. In fact the first scsi tower I had was made out of an old computer tower.

Alan.
 
I've made an offer on one of these units. It has 3 x 18G drives in it. So you think that any 80 pin would work in this enclosure with the MX? If I end up getting this one I'll post some results once I've tried to use it.

-andrew
 
I just wanted to report back that this setup works with my MX. I bought the 6 drive holder, put 3x18G and 1 73G drive in it. Of course I got an external cable and terminator for the box. I was able to back up to it and play tracks from it. I haven't actually recorded anything to it yet but don't see that as being an issue. The 80 pin drives that fit in the unit are cheaper from what I've been able to find. I think this is going to be a workable thing for me.

-andrew
 
Glad that worked out, food for thought for me too to add drives, I did know someone that had used 80 pin drives with an adaptor on the back but not an 80 pin enclosure, but I could see no reason why it would not work.

Alan
 
I am having trouble copying from one drive to the other. I can record new tracks and play them back but I keep getting errors when I try to copy the files to another drive. Once I've gotten an error, there is no hope of copying the file to that drive again. Does the MX not allow for overwrites? Something is weird about it.

-andrew
 
There are a couple of things that can bring up an error, the main reason I have found is trying to do a copy (or back up) while the MX has not finished writing the graphics files for the project. This is when you stop recording and the MX is churning away changing the red solid bars first to grey, then the wav graphics appear. Then you do a copy while this is going on, when the MX does a verification it sees that the graphics have changed and thinks there is an error. This graphics / verification error sometime happens if you zoom in or out just before doing a copy as the graphics files are changing while the copy is going on.

The reason that then you can't do copy after a failure is that there is a folder created on the destination drive in the project name and that folder is corrupted. This can sometimes be fixed by doing a disc clean up on the destination drive.

I should have asked if you are using MX view or operating from the front panel?

Alan.
 
I use MX View to copy the files. It seems now that the drive with the original files will not mount. I was able to use the disk cleanup on the destination drive and I think it is OK. Any ideas how to get my original drive back operational? I connected it to my Windows machine that has the SCSI card but it doesn't show the drives in my Windows Explorer. It does tell me that my original drive is "healthy" but I can't see any files on it. When I use the SCSI utility to check it, it is OK too.

-andrew
 
Is the drive spinning up when connected to the MX?
Have you tried connecting the original drive with no other drives connected?
On the windows machine, do you have the file viewing set to view hidden files?
And are there any when this is on?

Alan.
 
Is the drive spinning up when connected to the MX?
Yes, it spins.

Have you tried connecting the original drive with no other drives connected?
Yes. It still will not see it to mount.

On the windows machine, do you have the file viewing set to view hidden files?
I don't even see the SCSI drive listed. I will retry changing the settings and see if this makes a difference.

And are there any when this is on?
Not sure what you mean.

I bought the Acronis Disk software thinking it was more than just setup options for the disk. I thought that it might have some drill down file structure that would let me look at the disks.

-andrew
 
When you connect a scsi to a PC via the scsi card the PC should see the drive as a normal drive attached to the PC and the TL.projects will be in folder. If the PC is not seeing the drive at all the drive may have died. Have you tried connecting a good drive to check if there is a scsi problem with the PC? Also do you need to have the active terminator in the system the way you have it connected to the PC?

I have had this can't see a drive problem with secondhand drives that I have bought and it is usually a format problem, but if this drive was working it's more of a puzzle.

And are there any when this is on?: I meant when the hidden file setting is on do you see any files at all?

I bought the Acronis Disk software : Which one did you get? With the disc director it is possible to check the formatting and to format a stubborn drive, but if disc director can't see anything it looks bad for the drive.

Wish I could help more, I know how frustrating this can be.

One last thing it could be, although some of the symptoms don't add up, if a drive has not been low level formatted in a long time you get a build up of project folders, these are not deleted even if you do a low level clean up, when there are too many folders the drive can refuse to mount or be very long mounting.

Alan.
 
I'm beginning to suspect I have some incorrect settings. I can see the drives with Disk Director and it says they are healthy but I can't see them in Windows Explorer. I disconnected the cable from the computer and put it in the rear SCSI port of the MX. I was able to see all four drives and to write to them.

The drives have all had a LLF recently so I feel pretty good about that. My SCSI card sees the drives and I've been able to format them there as well as check their health (using the SCSI utility on the card at boot up). It actually lists the connected drives during the boot sequence and I can see them there too.

My computer has Vista, which is new to me, but it seems to be mostly the same as other Windows. I wouldn't worry so much except the drive I need to read does not have any backup so all will be lost. That's a hard lesson to learn!

-andrew
 
When you connect the drives to the PC, are you connecting the drives and powering them up before starting windows? I ask because on my PC if connect then after windows has started it can't find them, but if I connect before I start up windows they appear in explorer.

I have used both windows 2000 (my old PC that has a scsi tower connected to it) and my XP pro machine, that just has a scsi card, and both seem to want to be connected before startup.

Alan.
 
I restart Windows each time I connect up my drive rack. I'm afraid I've lost my data. When I look in Disk Management in Windows it tells me the drive is not initialized. That's probably why it's not mounting too. Gosh, I hate to lose all of that work.
 
What puzzles me is how the drive suddenly lost everything? Unless the drive has died completely. One last thing to look at, is there some way a pinout bridge on one of the option pins on the drive has fallen off and drive is not responding because of it? Have you the brand and model of the drive, I could look up the standard pinouts?

The drive that's stopped, is it the original 68 pin drive or one of the 80 pin drives from the scsi tower?

I can never stress enough about backups to people, I always have at least 2 drives on my MX while working and back up to the second drive every time we have a keeper take. When working on long term projects I also have a TL backup on the PC & a NAS box from the last session. I even have a rack out scsi drive with all current projects backed up under the seat of the car so that if something is stolen from the studio (or a fire) I have a backup of the projects. My backup system has saved the day many times.

Alan.
 
This all started once I got my multi-drive enclosure going and started trying to make backup copies. If I'm just recording (writing) and mixing (reading) it behaves properly. What seems to be happening is that it will copy several files from one drive to another. At some point I will get an error in the Smart Copy check and then both drives start acting funny then eventually not responding. I have reformatted some of the empty drives after this happens and they are fine mechanically and work as they should.

I have had issues with 68 and 80 pin drives. Like I said, it seems to hang up on the copy process. I don't think there are problems with the pinouts but I will check this evening. I have been using MX View to make the copies. Do you use this or do you go with the front panel? I'm wondering if that might be part of my problem.

-andrew
 
Can you try an experiment, if you are copying several projects at a time, try only doing one at a time. Also if the project is open when doing the backup try closing it first, it should copy while open but I am trying to figure out if there is some kind of file writing still going on while you are doing the back up.

When drives act funny:
Drive is getting too hot
Drive is on the way to failure
Drive has too many project folders
(Time for a low level format) if you check the drive on a PC it has a whole lot of folders including a copy of each project folder (empty) which I think it uses for carrying out smart copy/backups. If you get a smart copy failure a phantom folder appears and it stops you doing a back up of the project from then on, you can delete it from a PC or sometimes a disk cleanup can fix it.

Drive not mounting:
2 drives have the same scsi ID
Drive has too many project folders (see above)
drive is dead
scsi connections faulty or wrong
Active SCSI terminator not fitted (when using drives external to the MX)
No or Low drive power supply

This stuff can be so frustrating and I have had more than my fair share of these problems over the years, so I sympathise with you.

I use MX view for everything, I almost never use the front panel except to mount and un-mount the drives and to select setup options. I do also have a remote so I sometimes arm tracks and select options from this (also gives me a break from the computer screen).

Alan.
 
I think I've solved one problem. The second slot of the multi drive will not let me copy to any drive I put in it. I moved the drive to another slot and was able to copy all of my files without a hitch. I still have to see if I can salvage one of my other 68 pin drives. I have to use a carrier and the front slot on the MX to use that style.

One thing that I did tonight was LLF and then Initialize a drive on the MX. I then connected it to my computer with the SCSI card. I am still not able to see drive in Windows Explorer. I'm wondering if it's a function of Vista? The Adaptec help says that their card/driver works with Vista but I don't see it there. I can see it at boot and it appears on Disk Director but it's like it's uninitialized. It would be nice to be able to see the files that are on the disk in Windows.

I appreciate you taking the time to respond from the other side of the world. Crazy time we live in, huh?!?

-andrew
 
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