What's next?

[Muziekschuur]

Less and less stores are stocking the DM3200. The DM4800 was sold out more then a year ago. And Tascam has not yet released anything about a new console, remote controller or anything big really. I do hope there will be something new.....

In the mean time I wonder where computing is heading. New directions are slow. And the formfactor and connections seem all been established..... hmm... It's been quiet.

 

[cmaffia]

According to my reliable sources... nothing. Supposedly there was talk about 3 years ago to develop a successor to the DM series but it was eventually cancelled.
Tascam seems to be going the modular route (DA-3000, DA-6400, Clocking devices, Audio Interfaces, etc.) and abandoning the "all-in-one" solution. Apparently the tactile feel of real knobs (control surface) is a thing of the past and touch screens are the future.... at least I think that is what the market is going to push. Smaller footprint in studios yada yada yada ho hum.

 

[Gerk]

I think that's the direction that most companies are taking sadly. While I do like to have simple rack mount interfaces it's still nice to have a real console at some point.

I just picked up one of these: (Raven MTi2 multi touch controller):

http://www.slatemt.com/products/raven-mti/

I have to say it's pretty awesome. It's nice to have a good controller for the price and it's awesome how much stuff you can do with it. Between the Batch Commander/Raven software and just having the ability to open up plugins and "touch" them is awesome. It's so much better than having to turn generic knobs to control plugins. I thought I would miss the tactile response of using real faders, but honestly I don't.

I still have (and use) my DM-3200 and will until the day it stops working most likely. I just had a custom desk built to hold it! But that said, I only use it when I need to track more than two mics/inputs at once (which isn't all that often). For the simple stuff I use my UAD Apollo Twin which has amazing preamps. At some point I will most likely also pick up a larger Apollo interface with more inputs, but whew ... they are not cheap.

I had been using my 3200 as a control surface, but now that I have this new controller it's one less thing my 3200 is useful for ...

Ignore the mess on the desk, still in transition mode trying to figure out how to best deal with the new controller ...

 

[Gerk]

Also with people like Behringer getting into the game (tons of people are moving to X-32s) it's just not a market that's worth chasing any more for lots of companies. It's super hard to compete with those guys, their price points are pretty darned good.

 

[cmaffia]

It looks impressive! however until I no longer need to track more than 10 mics at once, I need my beloved DM3200. I have 2 of them and I will admit cascading them is more DM than I will ever need. Regardless, my studio requires all the bells and whistles it comes with. If vinyl records can make a comeback as well as tube amps, then I believe products like the DM mixers can too.

 

[Gerk]

I still do love my DM-3200, don't get me wrong ... but I rarely have to track that much stuff at once these days (at least until I get the time to finish things up and get my drum kit and percussion world set back up again).

 

[Muziekschuur]

There will stay a market for these units. I do hope Tascam will see that. But with things like Mackie Control needing loads of support, the question is, do they need this market share. And I guess their focus now lays elsewhere.

I was hoping, since Gibson owns their own ethernet protocol, they would go big with that. It now seems Roland is doing that. Something I never expected. Anyway.... The DM3200 & DM4800 are now very comfortable on the Mac and pc. Seems like a follow up would have been nice.

 

[Gravity Jim]

Craig Anderton and I were talking at NAMM one year about our digital consoles (he was a RAMSA endorsee, I was using an 02R), when he called digital consoles "the market that never happened." And he was right. People I know who work in digital technologies (not just audio) asked me why I didn't just take things ITB when I bought my DM3200. Even my wife wondered why I bothered shuttling digital audio in and out of the computer.

The truth is that it was simply the way I was used to working, and I expected going ITB would require a lot of new learning. My mistake. It hasn't, and working ITB is much more direct. For young people coming up, they're used to getting the results they want with an interface and a Macbook. There's no barrier to ITB for them: it's what they're used to.

As for Gibson, they have a rep for buying companies not for the products they produce or the markets they're in, but for specific tech they want in order to expand their own ideas. The first Gibons/Tascam product after the purchase wasn't great new drivers for existing units: it was a guitar cable that recorded whatever you played through it.

All this adds up to a rapidly shifting market where there isn't a place for small format consoles. Unless you're ready to buy an SSL Matrix or a API Box, a console just takes up space.

I bought my 3200 for its elegance, because that's what I'm drawn to. The elegance of my current studio - 3 widescreen displays (the center one is a Raven MTi2), two sets of monitors, an Arturia 49 on a sliding shelf under the Mac keyboard, a small rack of preamps and a single chrome volume knob - is incomparable, and preparing to work, saving a mix, automation are all faster and easier than before. The DP Meter Bridge displays all inputs, outputs, busses, VIs and track level information in one window. The counter display shows measures and beats, real time and SMPTE time code all at once. I can adjust plug-in parameters with a fingertip.

I was resistant to it for many years, but this is simply a better way to approach production. New producers don't want a follow up to the DM, Gibson doesn't want one, and now that devices like the Raven have reached the right price, more and more of us at a crossroads will opt for the enormous flexibility and future-proofing that software provides.

I loved my DM3200, but I'm pretty sure digital consoles as a category are EOL at Tascam.

 

[Muziekschuur]

That may be. But a Multi channel meter, faders, scroll wheel, transport button, audio card, preamps and channel indicators, buttons and (function) knobs are still as viable as they ever were. Wich leaves the question.

A flat touch screen, I'm not gonna stare into that.

What's tascam gonna do about it.

 

[Gerk]

I'm staring into the exact same touch screen right now and it's sitting beside my DM 3200 (or rather my DM 3200 is sitting beside it because the touch screen is front and center).

Tascam is not going to do anything about it, in fact almost no one is aside from Behringer at the moment. I'm ok going mostly ITB now, I have been mixing like that for some time. My consoles have been glorified I/O units -- albeit really controllable nice ones!

 

[Muziekschuur]

I understand. Maybe they will manufacter a nice Mackie controll clone. Something wich doesn't give you the throw away dish set feel.

 

[Gravity Jim]

I'm not trying to sell anybody.

But I'm finding that "actual faders" are less impressive than I used to think. As for outboard... most of my outboard instruments sounded so dated that I never turned them on, and my outboard reverbs were getting crushed by ITB reverbs like the Relab LX480. I still run my Roland JV1080, and I just plugged it into the MOTU 896mk3 and it shows up as an instrument in DP just like any VI does. You can run sends and returns through a software mixer exactly the same way you do in hardware and create aux channels the same way... you just don't run out of them. Same thing for my onboard preamps (I could use the pres in the interface, but I really like these Pro MPA IIs I have). If I needed more ins and outs for more outboard, I'd just plug in an expander. It's much, much simpler than I figured it would be.

But there's no debate about whether or not the DM is dying: it's already dead. The 4800 is gone, the FireWire card is gone, the cascade cables are gone, and when Tascam runs out of primary processing chips, the 3200 will be gone. I don't see anybody on the horizon who will replace it, except Behringer, and I expect to see a rush to touch screens with the success of the Raven. The move to ITB production has been inexorable since the introduction of Gigasampler (marketed by Tascam, ironically, as GigaStudio), and for small studios is done: they're unpacking boxes and putting away the dinnerware.

 

[Gerk]

I'm with you there Jim. Between my Raven and the UAD Apollo ... the only thing my DM 3200 will be used to do for the foreseeable future is when I need to track a lot of inputs at the same time ... and that's only because I can't afford a pair of UAD Apollo 8ps But hey, with that little usage my screen will last me a lifetime!

 

[Muziekschuur]

The DM3200 and DM4800 were a great solution. And can be again for studios around the world. I reckon since TMD8000 units are still mostly working. These units will stay in the air. For a long time. Allthough users (while using them)think ; we don't use em often....

 

[Tuviel]

I for one can't wait for guys to start selling their DM's and IF cards for silly cheap. I could find a use for another IF-AN. I have a dm3200 and the ease of which you can integrate outboard when tracking is ridiculous. I just love this desk and I'm definitely planning on getting a 4800 sooner or later.

I mix mostly ITB too but always get excited at the thought of going into remote layer and riding faders. Makes creating music fun again. My day job is in Telecom supporting Telepresence and Immersive systems with all kinds of touch screen tech so it doesn't really appeal to me to stare at a screen when I'm making records. That's just me though...

 

[waterstrum]

I'm still loving my DM.
Just today recorded 18 tracks of drums and band at 96k.
Pretty cool for a "DM is dying: it's already dead" mixing console.
I think there is still some life left here. ;-)

 

[cmaffia]

@waterstrum "Still some life left here" is an understatement. The DM's are chock full of bells and whistles. Honestly, the only reason to get rid of your DM is if lots of cables annoy you and space is an issue. Other than that, it still beats the pants off the new digital generation in many ways. In 2016, our DM's are probably viewed by outsiders as a "luxury" or "unnecessary convenience". Not bad for a machine that was released 10 years ago.

 

[goodflow]

Yamaha TF5 (and its smaller siblings) looks pretty dang nice, and at a lower price point than where the DM's hit the market. I'm thinking of auditioning one of these later on this year- seems like a Cubase-studio owner's dreams come true, I'm eagerly looking forward to the evolution of this desk (and future incarnations of Cubase along with it).

http://usa.yamaha.com/products/live_sound/mixers/digital-mixers/tf/tf5/

 

[Gerk]

@waterstrum "Still some life left here" is an understatement. The DM's are chock full of bells and whistles. Honestly, the only reason to get rid of your DM is if lots of cables annoy you and space is an issue. Other than that, it still beats the pants off the new digital generation in many ways. In 2016, our DM's are probably viewed by outsiders as a "luxury" or "unnecessary convenience". Not bad for a machine that was released 10 years ago.

Yes and no. If you want or need a full digital console then sure, but if you're talking about "beats the pants off" in terms of converters or pre's ... not so much. They are fine and get the job done, but they don't beat the pants off of all that much these days. There are some truly killer pres and converters out there these days ...

 

[cmaffia]

Got lots external pres hooked up and as well as alternate converters. Please refer me to a digital console that has all of the amenities of the DM in its price range and beats the pants off of it. I'll buy it. To me that would have been the DM3200/4800 successor. Also, I'll bet those killer pres and converters you are referring to together cost more that what a new DM3200 costs today. Sure we can all build a kickass recording rig with unit A and interface it to unit B. That's not what I'm getting at. For me the DM with a FireWire card is "one stop shopping" that serves me well. If albums were made using it 10 years ago, then it's good enough for me today. When it dies beyond repair, that's when I will move on.